Quote by Devildudemerged: 06-04-2006 ~ 07:08pm
ok... after reading the links and all that, for a short period of time I was
gonna sum something up...
and then this:
I'm barely able to catch up with your discussion! Am I dumb or
sth? I find it rly rly hard to... I don't knowXD I mean it's
levels above my level & in english omg ;_; Now I feel sad for not
being from England or America *_*
Anywayyy as for the marriage of gay couples... I mean this kind of topic is sooo
familiar... Personally I do approve gay ppl having an affair or so, like a
straight couple has, but actually I'm against the marriage thing>o<
My poing of view is that ppl marry cause they want to have a family u know, with
kids ect. and that's the main difference between an un-married & a married
couple ~childern~
So I can't believe that a kid can grow up normally in an environment with two
mothers or two farthers so sth. It's totally abnormal! Not only the child is
going to have lots of problems with his/her social life but with the personal
life too!
But if a gay couple rly want to get married for the title ~married~ what can I
say, go ahead, as long as it doesn't envovle in it other ppl lives
Well I know this is somewhat off topic but i wanted to know what everyone here
thought about Gay marriage, the senate is voting to try to place a constitunial
ban on it, and if the senate passes it two thirds of the states then have to
pass it the president of course supports the ban.
So what do my fellow Athiexsts and and agnostics think?
thanks, I viewed that sometime before, prolly not good enough, but I guess I was
too dumb to really put it to good use.
Anyhow, thanks, will try again once that dude stop being sarcastic over
himself.
merged: 06-04-2006 ~ 07:08pm
ok... after reading the links and all that, for a short period of time I was
gonna sum something up...
and then this:
Quote by Devildudeok, I concluded that
I was more or less utterly defeated...
what that dude said in the thread I posted earlier was indeed correct. in a
sense, I did not have enough evidence. ugh.
I'd post on that site too, but I don't have time. I'll leave you with some quick
links:
-http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/evolution/library/faq/cat02.html
^ Humans didn't evolve from monkeys, I thought I saw you guys make that
mistake
-http://www.sciam.com/article.cfm?articleID=000D4FEC-7D5B-1D07-8E49809EC588EEDF&pageNumber=1&catID=2
^ Informative article, a bit long though
-http://www.atheistnetwork.com/viewtopic.php?t=3035
^ Some more information
ok, I concluded that I was more or less utterly defeated...
what that dude said in the thread I posted earlier was indeed correct. in a
sense, I did not have enough evidence. ugh.
I always was an Athiest, my family never really participated in religon and
never went to church, so other then that the other reason i am an athiest is
because i do not see any rational reasons why i should belive in a God, On top
of that i have no strong urge to worship something, or follow by someonelses
rules that were made a few thousand years ago, well yea thats my horrible
answer.
though i would like to point out i was researching on buddhisim and some sects
of buddhisim are atheistic so, you can technicaly be a buddhist who is also
athiest( my source is World Book 2004)
Quote by Devildudehmm, nice pointers,
but it aint helping me much. Thanks anyway.
maybe you guys could make a know on how you guys started getting into
atheism?
anytime:x but actually the things I've said kinda sound like irrelevant to your
answer:x sorry "
anywayz I'm from a christian family I mean here in my country almost everyone is
christian! and especially in my town where there isn't lots of ppl believing sth
else, having another religion or so! My dad kinda don't like the things that the
priests here say or do! I think that he is right cause the only thing they want
to have is more and more and more wealth, they don't even care about the
believers, he just thinks that one of the most great religions ever was the one
the ancient Greek believed, he got a point actually cause the were more human
like, they had passions, problems, they were fighting like ppl do! Humans &
gods were contected and that religion lead ppl to find the prefecture, beauty
was the right think, the one god approved! On the other hand christians believe
in a god who is not connected with the ppl at all, he is just perfect, and let
the thing that all the saints are so old & skinny & ugly should I say?
So in the end should we try to become sth like that? Sth that doesn't fulfill us
in the first place?
Daddy isn't an atheist but he actually has some strange points & opions so
when he discusses this kind of things with the other they look him as if he is
an alien or sth!
About me now:x except from the insiration dad gave me, suddenly I've found my
self asking lots of questions and especially my theologist in school. But
unfortunately very few had direct answers! It was complicated for me in a way
cause like a teenage I rly like asking and not accepting things without a doubt.
So last summer I've started liking science & especially physiks not as a
subject ~so boring~ but as something that is all around as & it's so
perfect. Stephen Hawking, Einstein and lots lots of other scientists came to me
as the answer of all the questions. I do believe that belief in science is far
more creative than belief in religion. So at times like this I wondered do I rly
believe in god? Surely not, but if suddenly scientists become saints, I may
believe actually!
that's a part of my story*_* glad to hear about yours too
hmm, nice pointers, but it aint helping me much. Thanks anyway.
maybe you guys could make a know on how you guys started getting into
atheism?
Here is mine:
I was explaining this to Ishimi:
so you are interested in asking me that why do I hold Atheist beliefs yes?
well then perhaps I should then ask that you stop to think now, please do not in
any way, after reading attempt to convert me or ask me to read the bible and
what not. OK? deal?
Now, let me explain.
Like you I was once a believer, I am a Buddhist by family, and worships by
heart, Christianity, I do not really like Buddhism, as it is kinda worshiping an
idol until I realize that Buddhism was diluted over my family's end, we should
have been learning from him his great wisdom, not worship him.
Anyway, I took myself into christian faith for about two years, perhaps due to
my education and learning of many things through my ability to tune in Discovery
channel and reading a lot of articles, I begin to question why should I even
believe?
Then I stumbled, for the first time, an atheist community, and they welcomed me,
a believer, into their community, and I began to ask questions, same as what you
ask me now, why do they NOT believe? Then, they asked me, why do I ask?
I simply replied I wanted to know why should I believe, so thus, they explained
to me how it was and so on, I was exposed to science and knowledge and atheist
viewpoint, and I continously question my belief, until I can no longer stand
it.
I decided enough was enough, no matter how I look and how I analyse, everything
whatever was attached to religion is just plain ridiculous, no matter whatever
questions I have, in the end, after beating around 40000 acres of bushes, the
question could have been answered by 3 alphabets = GOD.
I was so tired of it, no matter where I look, I can never find the answer I am
looking for, and I tried to keep my faith, believe me, I did and I really did, I
even confessed I was betraying his love, and a priest tried to help me but in
there, I know, no matter how I tried, I never could get an answer that I could
see, hear or even know about, in the end, again, "it is meant to be cause
God wants it to be"
I was so tired of that answer I step out of religion once and for all, I will
never set foot into any religion affairs ever, and through that, I embraced my
family's original Buddhism beliefs, I decided he was the best teacher, and
learned his morals and wisdom instead, mind you, I never worshipped him as a God
of demi-God or whatever, I simply read mantras, and understand what they
say.
pretty much the same as love your fellow people, learn how to tolerate others
etc... do not unto others what you will not do unto yourself.
and the such, and I feel it was enough. I stopped believing in a God or superior
being, there is too much left to ask, and too many questions, that never get
answers, based on my nature to ask for answers, I decided to continue my faith
would be just denying myself.
Hence, why from there on, I am now a 4 years deep Atheist.
However, I practice soft atheism, I will not denounce there is a superior being,
provided there is a proof. But I do not see any, so no deal until I see
something.
Oh i agree with devil dude, one from my small understanding there is more proof
that Siddahara( Buddha) existed 800 years earlier then Jesus did i think he was
just a fitious chareter, he was probably someone who was made up so that the
people could be controlled. and obviously even if he was real it was by no
Virgin Birth( thats impossible mind you)
Oh just a suggestion to anyone who goes to the movies go see the Movie An
Inconvient Truth it was a project by AL Gore our Former Vice President, it's
about Globabl warming and how it is being ignordered by the populus.
Quote by Devildudeit was possible, at
the time, due to the circumstances, it is highly improbable for families to
trace their offsprings whereabouts, many children were lost during the times of
chaos, not surprising, if it was possible, Jesus could possible be a human from
some other family, adopted or otherwise.
I have a question, could anyone please review this with me and help me with any
points that I can further elaborate to help my side of the argument?
heyy nice talk btw^^ rly interested in your point of view actually but I rly
want to ask sth, y do you talk with these ppl, not only about this but any other
subjects? I mean they are sooo narrowminded ~if there is even a word like
thatXD~ they even believe what the bible says literally! For god's sake for one
moment I thought that you were talking to ppl from the medieval times or sth!
& let me tell you one other thing, the thing the bible says is sth like the
fairytales! for ex. when ppl couldn't actually understand what the thunder or
rain was they immediately desided to create the god of thunder and the god of
rain or sth! So the god, bible is talking about is sth like that! Ppl couldn't
understand how the hell someone can make the world and the universe so they
created a god doing this kind of job! My opinion is that Jesus is sth like the
gods of greek or chinese history! These ppl don't even know what the word proof
means! & actually there is a liiiittle point where religion & sience can
agree! Think that if we don't take what bible says literally, we could conclude:
What if adam & eva weren't actually humans?
What if the were just human like?
What if they were actually appes?
and finally what if creation was a primitive version of the modern
evolution?
wish I helped you with some points^^
great conversation btwXD
it was possible, at the time, due to the circumstances, it is highly improbable
for families to trace their offsprings whereabouts, many children were lost
during the times of chaos, not surprising, if it was possible, Jesus could
possible be a human from some other family, adopted or otherwise.
Quote by blackchiiwell well well, i'm
surprised there's a group like this in MT.. a good place for an atheist like me
to share a thought. i believe 'fate' is for us to decide.. not this fictional
gods
Quote by Devildude
by the way, who here agrees with me that Jesus was a man-made fictionious
character or a scapegoat?
well, i'm one of them
XD definately! can't also believe that Mary became pregnant without actually
havin an affair & by the holly spirit or sth...
propably she had been envolved with someone, she became pregnant & she said
to her parents "mammy, daddy god made me be pregnant, I'm still a
virgin" and they believed her>o<
well well well, i'm surprised there's a group like this in MT.. a good place for
an atheist like me to share a thought. i believe 'fate' is for us to decide..
not this fictional gods
Quote by Devildude
by the way, who here agrees with me that Jesus was a man-made fictionious
character or a scapegoat?
hey ya thar:x
came by to say hi^^
glad to hear that there is actually a group here where ppl can talk about these
things>o<
here ppl think that I'm a little bit crazy for not actually believing in god or
his existence:x
Although I'm not a strong atheist, I'm surely an atheistXD
new member here btw >o<
~waves~
Aye, many MT members are also members there.
guess we are on the same wavelength.
I think I can pretty much be a soft atheist, again, perhaps I am just a plain
joe.
by the way, who here agrees with me that Jesus was a man-made fictionious
character or a scapegoat?
Yay! Thanks for joining Devildude! We're happy to have another member!
^^
Also, that site looks great! Whoever made it is amazing, their style
(CSS+Graphics+Layout) is amazing! Interesting thread too. I saw that ProgramZERO
posted there, weird. Didn't expect that. Well, thanks again for joining!
Quote by Haohmaru77Yay!
*jumps**coughs**falls to the floor* my name is there! Yay again! Please, i want
no guestbook posts saying "haoh, why do you believe in god?" or
"explain this to me: if god existed, why..." all questions i can
answer shall be asked and maybe answered here in the group. Also, remember i'm
not god, so i dont know many things ...
Ha, I just hope the group doesn't start getting too big or else it might be hard
to keep up with the list and I'll be forced to take it down. Doesn't look like
I'll have to worry about that for a while though. =P
Yay! *jumps**coughs**falls to the floor* my name is there! Yay again! Please, i
want no guestbook posts saying "haoh, why do you believe in god?" or
"explain this to me: if god existed, why..." all questions i can
answer shall be asked and maybe answered here in the group. Also, remember i'm
not god, so i dont know many things ...
Quote by lindorkYay... I've joined.
I wouldn't classify my religion as an atheist though,
since calling Atheism a religion is calling baldness a hair color
hahaha...
levels above my level & in english omg ;_; Now I feel sad for not
being from England or America *_*
Anywayyy as for the marriage of gay couples... I mean this kind of topic is sooo familiar... Personally I do approve gay ppl having an affair or so, like a straight couple has, but actually I'm against the marriage thing>o<
My poing of view is that ppl marry cause they want to have a family u know, with kids ect. and that's the main difference between an un-married & a married couple ~childern~
So I can't believe that a kid can grow up normally in an environment with two mothers or two farthers so sth. It's totally abnormal! Not only the child is going to have lots of problems with his/her social life but with the personal life too!
But if a gay couple rly want to get married for the title ~married~ what can I say, go ahead, as long as it doesn't envovle in it other ppl lives
Well I know this is somewhat off topic but i wanted to know what everyone here thought about Gay marriage, the senate is voting to try to place a constitunial ban on it, and if the senate passes it two thirds of the states then have to pass it the president of course supports the ban.
So what do my fellow Athiexsts and and agnostics think?
merged: 06-04-2006 ~ 09:26pm
Atheists*
thanks, I viewed that sometime before, prolly not good enough, but I guess I was too dumb to really put it to good use.
Anyhow, thanks, will try again once that dude stop being sarcastic over himself.
merged: 06-04-2006 ~ 07:08pm
ok... after reading the links and all that, for a short period of time I was gonna sum something up...
and then this:
http://forums.bleachportal.net/showpost.php?p=486225&postcount=75
I'd post on that site too, but I don't have time. I'll leave you with some quick links:
-http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/evolution/library/faq/cat02.html
^ Humans didn't evolve from monkeys, I thought I saw you guys make that mistake
-http://www.sciam.com/article.cfm?articleID=000D4FEC-7D5B-1D07-8E49809EC588EEDF&pageNumber=1&catID=2
^ Informative article, a bit long though
-http://www.atheistnetwork.com/viewtopic.php?t=3035
^ Some more information
Hope that helps you! ^_^
ok, I concluded that I was more or less utterly defeated...
what that dude said in the thread I posted earlier was indeed correct. in a sense, I did not have enough evidence. ugh.
I always was an Athiest, my family never really participated in religon and never went to church, so other then that the other reason i am an athiest is because i do not see any rational reasons why i should belive in a God, On top of that i have no strong urge to worship something, or follow by someonelses rules that were made a few thousand years ago, well yea thats my horrible answer.
though i would like to point out i was researching on buddhisim and some sects of buddhisim are atheistic so, you can technicaly be a buddhist who is also athiest( my source is World Book 2004)
anytime:x but actually the things I've said kinda sound like irrelevant to your answer:x sorry
"
anywayz I'm from a christian family I mean here in my country almost everyone is christian! and especially in my town where there isn't lots of ppl believing sth else, having another religion or so! My dad kinda don't like the things that the priests here say or do! I think that he is right cause the only thing they want to have is more and more and more wealth, they don't even care about the believers, he just thinks that one of the most great religions ever was the one the ancient Greek believed, he got a point actually cause the were more human like, they had passions, problems, they were fighting like ppl do! Humans & gods were contected and that religion lead ppl to find the prefecture, beauty was the right think, the one god approved! On the other hand christians believe in a god who is not connected with the ppl at all, he is just perfect, and let the thing that all the saints are so old & skinny & ugly should I say? So in the end should we try to become sth like that? Sth that doesn't fulfill us in the first place?
Daddy isn't an atheist but he actually has some strange points & opions so when he discusses this kind of things with the other they look him as if he is an alien or sth!
About me now:x except from the insiration dad gave me, suddenly I've found my self asking lots of questions and especially my theologist in school. But unfortunately very few had direct answers! It was complicated for me in a way cause like a teenage I rly like asking and not accepting things without a doubt. So last summer I've started liking science & especially physiks not as a subject ~so boring~ but as something that is all around as & it's so perfect. Stephen Hawking, Einstein and lots lots of other scientists came to me as the answer of all the questions. I do believe that belief in science is far more creative than belief in religion. So at times like this I wondered do I rly believe in god? Surely not, but if suddenly scientists become saints, I may believe actually!
that's a part of my story*_* glad to hear about yours too
hmm, nice pointers, but it aint helping me much. Thanks anyway.
maybe you guys could make a know on how you guys started getting into atheism?
Here is mine:
I was explaining this to Ishimi:
so you are interested in asking me that why do I hold Atheist beliefs yes?
well then perhaps I should then ask that you stop to think now, please do not in any way, after reading attempt to convert me or ask me to read the bible and what not. OK? deal?
Now, let me explain.
Like you I was once a believer, I am a Buddhist by family, and worships by heart, Christianity, I do not really like Buddhism, as it is kinda worshiping an idol until I realize that Buddhism was diluted over my family's end, we should have been learning from him his great wisdom, not worship him.
Anyway, I took myself into christian faith for about two years, perhaps due to my education and learning of many things through my ability to tune in Discovery channel and reading a lot of articles, I begin to question why should I even believe?
Then I stumbled, for the first time, an atheist community, and they welcomed me, a believer, into their community, and I began to ask questions, same as what you ask me now, why do they NOT believe? Then, they asked me, why do I ask?
I simply replied I wanted to know why should I believe, so thus, they explained to me how it was and so on, I was exposed to science and knowledge and atheist viewpoint, and I continously question my belief, until I can no longer stand it.
I decided enough was enough, no matter how I look and how I analyse, everything whatever was attached to religion is just plain ridiculous, no matter whatever questions I have, in the end, after beating around 40000 acres of bushes, the question could have been answered by 3 alphabets = GOD.
I was so tired of it, no matter where I look, I can never find the answer I am looking for, and I tried to keep my faith, believe me, I did and I really did, I even confessed I was betraying his love, and a priest tried to help me but in there, I know, no matter how I tried, I never could get an answer that I could see, hear or even know about, in the end, again, "it is meant to be cause God wants it to be"
I was so tired of that answer I step out of religion once and for all, I will never set foot into any religion affairs ever, and through that, I embraced my family's original Buddhism beliefs, I decided he was the best teacher, and learned his morals and wisdom instead, mind you, I never worshipped him as a God of demi-God or whatever, I simply read mantras, and understand what they say.
pretty much the same as love your fellow people, learn how to tolerate others etc... do not unto others what you will not do unto yourself.
and the such, and I feel it was enough. I stopped believing in a God or superior being, there is too much left to ask, and too many questions, that never get answers, based on my nature to ask for answers, I decided to continue my faith would be just denying myself.
Hence, why from there on, I am now a 4 years deep Atheist.
However, I practice soft atheism, I will not denounce there is a superior being, provided there is a proof. But I do not see any, so no deal until I see something.
Miracles and such do not count.
Oh i agree with devil dude, one from my small understanding there is more proof that Siddahara( Buddha) existed 800 years earlier then Jesus did i think he was just a fitious chareter, he was probably someone who was made up so that the people could be controlled. and obviously even if he was real it was by no Virgin Birth( thats impossible mind you)
Oh just a suggestion to anyone who goes to the movies go see the Movie An Inconvient Truth it was a project by AL Gore our Former Vice President, it's about Globabl warming and how it is being ignordered by the populus.
heyy nice talk btw^^ rly interested in your point of view actually but I rly want to ask sth, y do you talk with these ppl, not only about this but any other subjects? I mean they are sooo narrowminded ~if there is even a word like thatXD~ they even believe what the bible says literally! For god's sake for one moment I thought that you were talking to ppl from the medieval times or sth! & let me tell you one other thing, the thing the bible says is sth like the fairytales! for ex. when ppl couldn't actually understand what the thunder or rain was they immediately desided to create the god of thunder and the god of rain or sth! So the god, bible is talking about is sth like that! Ppl couldn't understand how the hell someone can make the world and the universe so they created a god doing this kind of job! My opinion is that Jesus is sth like the gods of greek or chinese history! These ppl don't even know what the word proof means! & actually there is a liiiittle point where religion & sience can agree! Think that if we don't take what bible says literally, we could conclude: What if adam & eva weren't actually humans?
What if the were just human like?
What if they were actually appes?
and finally what if creation was a primitive version of the modern evolution?
wish I helped you with some points^^
great conversation btwXD
it was possible, at the time, due to the circumstances, it is highly improbable for families to trace their offsprings whereabouts, many children were lost during the times of chaos, not surprising, if it was possible, Jesus could possible be a human from some other family, adopted or otherwise.
merged: 06-02-2006 ~ 05:54am
http://forums.bleachportal.net/showthread.php?t=12557&page=5
I have a question, could anyone please review this with me and help me with any points that I can further elaborate to help my side of the argument?
XD definately! can't also believe that Mary became pregnant without actually havin an affair & by the holly spirit or sth...
propably she had been envolved with someone, she became pregnant & she said to her parents "mammy, daddy god made me be pregnant, I'm still a virgin" and they believed her>o<
well well well, i'm surprised there's a group like this in MT.. a good place for an atheist like me to share a thought. i believe 'fate' is for us to decide.. not this fictional gods
well, i'm one of them
hey ya thar:x
came by to say hi^^
glad to hear that there is actually a group here where ppl can talk about these things>o<
here ppl think that I'm a little bit crazy for not actually believing in god or his existence:x
Although I'm not a strong atheist, I'm surely an atheistXD
new member here btw >o<
~waves~
is it cool if i join? if sothan i'm in!
merged: 05-31-2006 ~ 02:39am
let it be known that I am a strong atheist thats all
Aye, many MT members are also members there.
guess we are on the same wavelength.
I think I can pretty much be a soft atheist, again, perhaps I am just a plain joe.
by the way, who here agrees with me that Jesus was a man-made fictionious character or a scapegoat?
Yay! Thanks for joining Devildude! We're happy to have another member! ^^
Also, that site looks great! Whoever made it is amazing, their style (CSS+Graphics+Layout) is amazing! Interesting thread too. I saw that ProgramZERO posted there, weird. Didn't expect that. Well, thanks again for joining!
After long thoughts, I suppose I will join, just cause I am pissed by any fella coming, You should believe in God....
heh...
hope you guys don't mind me busting in?
funnily enough these people never give up, and well, just the other day I started this in Animepaper: http://www.animepaper.net/forums/General-Discussion/26208/2/
I sort of contradicted myself a bit, but well, nobody actually answered my question cause it was weird I guess.
I'm glad to see the group growing!
Yeah sure I'm interested. By the way I'm a strong atheist.
Ha, I just hope the group doesn't start getting too big or else it might be hard to keep up with the list and I'll be forced to take it down. Doesn't look like I'll have to worry about that for a while though. =P
Thanks for joining! ^^
Yay! *jumps**coughs**falls to the floor* my name is there! Yay again! Please, i want no guestbook posts saying "haoh, why do you believe in god?" or "explain this to me: if god existed, why..." all questions i can answer shall be asked and maybe answered here in the group. Also, remember i'm not god, so i dont know many things
...
Yay! Linda-niichan! Thanks for joining! *hug!* ^^
Yay! Welcome! Hope you like the group. = D
i've been accepted... yay! thanks.